Legislature(1995 - 1996)

03/27/1996 03:11 PM House L&C

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
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 SB 197 - INS: DOMESTIC VIOL. VICTIMS & DISCLOSURES                          
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN KOTT brought SB 197 before the committee and noted it had            
 been heard before.  He opened public testimony for Becky Achten,              
 who had not testified previously.                                             
                                                                               
 Number 1982                                                                   
                                                                               
 BECKY ACHTEN, Children's Counselor, Aiding Women from Abuse and               
 Rape Emergency (AWARE), testified in support of SB 197.  She                  
 stated, "I've read that half of the 16 major insurance companies              
 use domestic violence as a criteria to deny coverage or increase              
 rates for victims.  This says to me that insurance companies                  
 recognize the economic cost of domestic violence in this country.             
 But in order to resolve this economic problem, insurance companies            
 re-victimize the victim.  Failure to pass this bill in a form which           
 ensures its intent to protect victims of domestic violence from               
 discrimination, which would deny them medical coverage or raise               
 their rates, is also a re-victimization.  The problem is domestic             
 violence.  The question is:  Are we going to recognize the gravity            
 of this problem by allowing insurance companies to deny coverage to           
 victims, or are we going to address the problem [of] domestic                 
 violence and support Senate Bill 197 and others before you aimed at           
 protecting victims, perhaps protecting them before they are                   
 injured?  Shame on the insurance companies for denying coverage or            
 raising their rates to those who have suffered injuries.  I invite            
 them to join and unite and address the root cause of the problem,             
 domestic violence."                                                           
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN KOTT noted there was a committee substitute that had not             
 yet been adopted as a work draft, which added "or as required by              
 the division of insurance" at the bottom of page 1.                           
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER pointed out there were additional changes.              
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN KOTT called an at-ease at 4:43; the meeting resumed                  
 shortly thereafter.                                                           
                                                                               
 Number 2181                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA moved that the committee adopt the work draft           
 for SB 196, version M, dated 3/26/96.                                         
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG objected for purposes of discussion.                  
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER noted that Chairman Kott had mentioned the              
 addition on page 1.  He said the major change was a suggestion he             
 had worked out with the sponsor, which changed the disclosure                 
 requirement.  Instead of an insurance company being required to               
 automatically provide that information upon denial, the company               
 would advise anyone they denied of their right to have that                   
 information and if they received written notification, provide it.            
                                                                               
 Number 2332                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG withdrew his objection.                               
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN KOTT noted the committee substitute for CSSB 197, version            
 M, dated 3/26/96, was before them.                                            
                                                                               
 Number 2353                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG offered an amendment, which read:                     
                                                                               
      Section AS 21.36 is amended by adding new sections to read:              
                                                                               
           Sec. 21.36.430  INSURANCE FOR DOMESTIC VIOLENCE VICTIMS;            
           (a)  An insurer offering life, disability or health                 
      insurance in Alaska may not discriminate against a victim of             
      domestic abuse based on an individual's status as a victim of            
      domestic abuse.  This prohibition shall not prevent an insurer           
      from underwriting or rating for a medical condition in the               
      same manner as they would for an insured or applicant who is             
      not a victim of domestic abuse.                                          
           (b)  This section applies only to an insured or applicant           
      for insurance.                                                           
           (c)  An insurer is granted immunity for criminal or civil           
      liability resulting from compliance with this statute.                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG stated he had provided letters from eight             
 or nine insurance companies throughout the country.  "This was an             
 amendment that was in Mr. Lessmeier's letter, I believe, of                   
 March15," he said, commenting that was in the packet and                      
 duplicated a recommendation by State Farm.  "We've heard testimony            
 from the bill sponsor that he does not care for this language," he            
 said.  "But we also heard testimony in this committee that the                
 insurance industry was duly informed, and so forth, and had no                
 objections to this bill.  And the letters you have in hand directly           
 oppose what that testimony was.  And I'd like to take exception to            
 that."  He listed the insurance companies that had provided                   
 letters.                                                                      
                                                                               
 TAPE 96-31, SIDE A                                                            
 Number 0001                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG said, "What we don't want to do, I think,             
 particularly, and that's our charge in this committee, is to                  
 provide additional burdens on the insurance industry that are not             
 called for by any other type of classification of citizenry in this           
 country.  This is an extraordinary demand and I don't think we need           
 to do that to accomplish the purpose of this bill.  And I                     
 particularly take exception to the fact that ... the insurance                
 industry was duly represented at this table or in the Senate,                 
 because to my knowledge, they weren't.  And these letters speak for           
 that case.  So, that's why I'm bringing the amendment.  Also, the             
 amendment includes a deletion of the committee substitute section             
 (b), based on confidentiality.  Mr. Lessmeier's letter of                     
 March20th in your package clearly sets forward the lack of                    
 necessity of having this in the bill."  He specified he was                   
 referring to Section 1, subsection (b).                                       
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ELTON objected and then asked if Representative                
 Rokeberg had moved the amendment.                                             
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG moved the amendment.                                  
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA asked to hear from the sponsor.                         
                                                                               
 Number 0185                                                                   
                                                                               
 SENATOR DAVE DONLEY, sponsor of SB 197, said after consulting with            
 the Division of Insurance, he believed he could speak for them, as            
 well.  "We oppose this amendment for at least three reasons," he              
 stated.  "Number 1, it excludes specific lines of insurance from              
 coverage.  I guess if I was State Farm, I wouldn't want to have to            
 live under any new rules, either.  But this would say property is             
 no longer covered by the bill."                                               
                                                                               
 SENATOR DONLEY pointed out the committee had heard "horrific                  
 examples of discrimination against victims of domestic violence in            
 property lines of insurance".  He referred to the victim of an                
 arson attack, discussed in earlier testimony, whose insurance was             
 subsequently cancelled.  He referred to subsection (b) of the                 
 amendment, which said, "This section applies only to an insured or            
 applicant for insurance."  He said a third-party beneficiary could            
 be discriminated against on the basis of domestic violence, which             
 he believed was completely improper, as there may be other classes            
 of people who need protection from discrimination.                            
                                                                               
 SENATOR DONLEY said third, the amendment granted blanket immunity             
 that did not appear anywhere else in the insurance code for any               
 other action required of insurance companies.  Although insurance             
 companies had prohibitions against discrimination for reasons of              
 race and religion, for example, there was no blanket immunity for             
 any criminal or civil liability.  "No matter how they administer              
 it, how grossly negligent or even intentional their action was to             
 violate any other law that may conflict with this, they would be              
 granted blanket immunity," he noted.  "It just doesn't appear                 
 anywhere in the code like that.  And they've got all kinds of                 
 mandates in the code that they have to follow."                               
                                                                               
 Number 0370                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ELTON said he had a couple of problems with the                
 amendment.  First was the assumption that life, disability and                
 health insurance were the only insurance lines that needed                    
 addressed.  He noted there was information in his packet compiled             
 by the Women's Law Project in Philadelphia, which indicated                   
 shelters in Vermont were having a tough time getting insurance due            
 to rejections and high rates because of domestic violence.  A                 
 homeowner's policy in Washington state had been cancelled by Safeco           
 after receiving information about domestic violence-related claims.           
 Also in Washington, a landlord's policy was cancelled because the             
 insurer learned the landlord intended to rent to a women's shelter.           
 "I think there are examples out there.  And for us to say the only            
 applicable lines of insurance are life, disability and health                 
 insurance is misleading and addresses only a portion of the                   
 problem," Representative Elton stated, adding that he had not even            
 addressed sections (b) and (c) of the amendment.                              
                                                                               
 Number 0554                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ELTON referred to comments by Representative                   
 Rokeberg, sponsor of the amendment, that indicated the amendment              
 deleted subsection (b).  "I don't see where that happens," he said.           
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG replied, "Technically, this is supposed to            
 delete Section 1 and replace it."  He apologized for the confusion            
 and said, "If it's the will of the committee, I wouldn't look at it           
 as hostile to add property insurance into that.  I don't think                
 that's the intent here, to exclude that."                                     
                                                                               
 Number 0512                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ELTON asked if Representative Rokeberg would object            
 to removing the delineation and just saying "offering insurance".             
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG indicated he would not object to that, if             
 it would be the proper wording to cover all insurance.  "We don't             
 want to have any discrimination," he said.  "I don't disagree with            
 that."                                                                        
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked if the committee had done that or just            
 talked about it.                                                              
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN KOTT clarified they had just talked about it.                        
                                                                               
 Number 0554                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ELTON moved to delete "life, disability or health"             
 from the amendment.                                                           
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG interjected, objecting for discussion.  He            
 asked Mr. Lessmeier, attorney for State Farm, if he wanted to                 
 comment.                                                                      
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE ELTON said he wanted to know the difference between            
 domestic abuse and domestic violence, since the amendment talked              
 about domestic abuse.                                                         
                                                                               
 Number 0600                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. LESSMEIER claimed there was not, to his knowledge, a single               
 example of a problem in property/casualty.  "Our desire was to                
 limit the protection to where discrimination occurs," he said,                
 "which is in insurance over the person."  He responded to instances           
 cited by Representative Elton and said the first two dealt with               
 life insurance and the third was cancelled because of multiple                
 fires set in the home.  He said problems in Vermont with women's              
 shelters raised a concern of commercial insurance.  And the                   
 Washington state policy was denied because of multiple claims.  He            
 asserted there were no "valid" situations in the property and                 
 casualty business of discrimination based on status as a victim of            
 domestic violence.                                                            
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN KOTT noted there was a call to attend a House floor                  
 session.  He said SB 197 would be heard first at the next meeting.            

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